Episode 22 - The Holy Spirit - Pt 2

Speaker 1 00:00:07 Hello, and welcome to the unveiling with your hosts, IJ, mark, and Tim three guys discussing the one true gospel. We hope you enjoy today's discussion. Let's dive right in. Speaker 1 00:00:23 Welcome to the unveiling with your hosts, AJ and mark, and Tim. Now last episode, we started a conversation about the holy spirit, and I think we talked about the introduction of the spirit basically to the Christians in, in the new Testament. But we also expos that the holy spirit has been, you know, part of the Trinity of the Godhead for, for eternity. And we showed that he was throughout the Bible from Genesis to revelations. So today we're gonna take a slight pivot. And I think we're gonna start talking about the mission, the, the job of the holy spirit, so, so to speak. And some of that is tied up in the names of the holy spirit. So we, we may refer back and forth to them because like I mentioned, in Hebrew, a name is very important because it is considered a descriptor of the person who holds that name. But I don't want us to go ahead and dive right in. And so unlike last week, I am not gonna start us off. I'm gonna pitch this on over, and I'm gonna say, AJ, good evening. How are you doing? What have you got to bring to the bring to us today? Speaker 2 00:01:31 Hey, good evening, mark and Tim. It's so good to see you again as always. Yeah. So we are going to continue our, um, discussion for lack of better word of the holy spirit. And last time we talked about the person of the holy spirit, mostly. So now we want to, uh, talk a little bit about the work of the holy spirit or the ministry of the holy spirit or the role of the holy spirit in our life. So we've been talking about law and grace, the whole covenant and new covenant, um, for a long time on this, uh, podcast. And we know the two covenants, right? The old covenant and the new covenant. It's also called the law and grace and many a time. Uh, people think, you know, about the holy spirit. They relate the spirit more to the law, just like the law about do this. Speaker 2 00:02:24 And don't do this obey the law. You'll be blessed. And if you just obey the law, you'll be cursed. They basically, um, put holy spirit also in the same light, you know, holy spirit, this person, or the holy spirit tells me if I obey the holy spirit, I'll be blessed. And if I don't obey the holy spirit, I'll be cursed. But you know, I want to bring to light that, you know, actually the holy spirit is not in the law. In fact, we talked about it several times. You know, if you are under the law in Galatians, it says you cannot be led by the holy spirit. So in fact, holy spirit on the side of grace, and in fact, we could not know grace or the new covenant, unless the holy spirit actually revealed it to us. So I want to start with the scripture in, uh, second cor in chapter three, I'm going to read from verse one till, uh, five. Speaker 2 00:03:20 So Paul is writing to cor, he says, do we begin again to commend ourselves? Or do we need us some others episodes of recommendation to you or letters of recommendation from you? You are our episode returning our hearts known and read by all men. Clearly you are the of Christ stood by us return, not with the ink, but by the spirit of living God, not on tablets of stone, but on the tablets of flesh that is of, of the heart. And we have such trust through Christ toward God. Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency from God who also made the sufficient ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter, but of the spirit for the letter kills, but the spirit gives life. So if you read the whole chapter in context, you see that, you know, the new covenant is the ministry of the spirit. Speaker 2 00:04:18 And then in the first, as it says, right, you know, the spirit tries a new covenant on our hearts, right? Not, we think the new covenant is not written. We think, but it is written by the spirit of living God. So when we say the new covenant is a ministry of the spirit, there are two sides, right? You know, one is like, as mark said, and the last podcast, it's the it that reveals us of grace of God or the new covenant new covenant simply means, right? Grace means right. You, God freely forgives us. God freely receives us. God freely gives us eternal our life, right. And God freely gives us a spirit. So the spirit is the one that I actually ed the new covenant and in the new covenant, the spirit is also given to us, right? Spirit is the one that re reveals about the new covenant. Speaker 2 00:05:10 And when someone believes in the new covenant and believes on the Lord, Jesus Christ finished work, they actually spirit comes to well in them. So mark also mentioned that yesterday, when we were unbelievers, the spirit was working on the outside to convince of the gospel of grace. And when we actually believe in the gospel of grace, the spirit comes to rec side inside us. And we say that that is beautifully shown in act chapter two as well. So we all know right in on the day of Pentecost, all the apostles were waiting in the upper room. Then the spirit came, right? The spirit came and, uh, baptized them with the spirit as they were waiting on the spirit. Right. And as soon as the spirit came upon, Peter, what did he do? He preached the gospel. He preached the gospel of the Lord, Jesus Christ. Speaker 2 00:05:58 And then their response was, they said, man, and brother, and what shall we do? And Peter says, you know, repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the holy spirit. So here we say that Peter, by the holy spirit, praise the gospel and those, they received the spirit, those who believed in the gospel, they received the holy spirit. And we also see in Luke chapter four, we saw it, uh, the other day as well in the ministry of our Lord Jesus Christ. It says, okay. And Luke chapter four, you know, this is the first time in lodge is, is, uh, actually he starts his ministry after, uh, going to the wilderness and being tempted by the devil. He comes back and then he goes to a synagog a SA day. And then he picks up a scroll. And then he reads from Isaiah and Luke chapter four verse 18 says the spirit of the Lord is upon me because he anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor. So the spirit is given to us to preach the gospel, the gospel of grace. So the first and foremost ministry of the spirit in our life is to preach the gospel of grace. Speaker 3 00:07:15 That's good. Really good. So I'm remind, did I love second Corinthians three, which I think you all know that because I quoted just about every single <laugh> time on air and just in our personal, uh, correspondence. But I love that beginning of the first paragraph, you read AJ where it says for the letter kills, but the spirit gives life this whole chapter. And I just wanna encourage everybody out there. Second Corinthians chapter three, I spent like literally a year in that every day. In fact, I'm still talking about it all the time. It was the most revolutionary scripture I ever read, but the whole thing is a comparison of opposites, a comparison of the old covenant and the new covenant death and life condemnation righteousness. Well, so he says there that the letter kills and then he goes on and he says, and he says, um, and the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone. Speaker 3 00:08:19 So what was engraves and letters on stone? The law, the 10 commandments, right? So it's very clear, he's saying the 10 commandments, the law rules do this. Don't do that your own abilities to be good. Those kill. There's no life in that, but the ministry of the spirit is life. So, so the, um, opposites they keep saying are that the old covenant is the ministry of death and condemnation. That was only meant to be a transitory ministry to bring you to Christ. Okay. And then it says the new covenant is the ministry of righteousness and of life and of the spirit. It's I just love when things are so clear that way, that, so why in the world would anybody go looking in the old covenant in rules, regulations, the law, why would they go looking for life for righteousness or for the spirit there? Because it's devoid of all three of those. And yet we used to do that for decades ourselves. We thought that was the answer, but thank you Jesus, as, as possible, Paul said, uh, but thanks be to God for the victory we have in Jesus Christ. We're no longer a part of the death and condemnation. We're now a part of life righteousness and the spirit of God in us. So thanks for bringing that out, dad. Speaker 2 00:09:45 Yeah. So, uh, mark, if you're okay. Just want to dwell a little more on this, the two covenants, right? So dwell Speaker 3 00:09:53 Away. Speaker 2 00:09:54 <laugh> so, you know, we used to the law mentality, right? We think we have to do something to get something from God. Right? So in the old covenant, it says, um, the old covenant is, you know, we have to keep all the commandments, right. In order to get blessed under the world covenant. But you know, the new covenant is totally opposite. Many people, you know, when they hear the term covenant, you know, again, they think, you know, there is something for us to do in the new covenant. And it is very important to understand that under the new covenant, you know, it's not about doing it's about believing, receiving, and resting. And in fact, again, unless the spirit reveals to us, that new covenant of is simply about believing and receiving. We cannot know that because then we will approach a new covenant. Also like what much I do just like in John six people approach Jesus, asking what much I do then in the, the Centura and also ask Paul what much I do to be saved. Speaker 2 00:10:58 So the mentality is what much I do, but the answer is, you know, it's not in the doing, you simply believe. And that revelation has to come by the spirit. And in first instance, chapter two, if we see that clearly, right, you know, it says, uh, in, uh, you read this mark before, as well in fus cor in chapter two, this is, uh, also one of my favorite scriptures in, uh, first chapter two from 11, for what man knows the things of a man, except the spirit of man, which is in him even. So no one knows the things of God, except the spirit of God. Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the spirit of, but the spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. So again, it's a work of the spirit to reveal to us that grace of God is free. Speaker 2 00:11:53 You know, we can be saved freely and we can become righteous freely, and we can have eternal life freely. And one of the scripture is also my favorite in revelation chapter 22. Uh, I believe it's in, uh, just real quick. Let me look at that revel in chapter 22 and was 17. This is one of my favorite scriptures towards the end of all Bible, right? This is the invitation of the spirit to everybody 22. I believe the last chapter, there's one more, but 22 and 17, it says, and the spirit and the bride say come and him who hear, say, come and let him who thirst come and whoever desires, let him take off the water of life freely. So the key term here is freely. So whoever is thirsty, like Lord Jesus said in John chapter seven on the last day of the fish, he says, you know, if anyone is thirsty, let him come to me and drink, right? That's exactly the same invitation. If anyone is thirsty, let him come. And this gospel, right, this spirit is free to receive anyone who is thirsty. They can come and receive the water of life freely. So one of the important, I think the most primary, uh, ministry, our work of the holy spirit is to simply reveal to us the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to reveal to us that grace is free. Speaker 3 00:13:26 One thing I'd like to add to your, to reveal to us is putting an I N G on the end of that, his job is revealing the Lord Jesus Christ to us and his grace. Of course, they're saving revelation at the beginning, but as we go through our lives, we're getting more and more revelation, which I love. Exactly. Yeah. Which means in a year from now, I'm gonna know Christ more than I know him now that I can continually hope from glory to glory, that I'm gonna know him better. Speaker 1 00:13:56 It's a wonderful thing. As we study and prepare for these podcasts, how much we converse on around and outside of this and how much revelation we still can find, even in stuff that we mark, I, I think you have almost laid claim to Corinthians chapter three. Um, but even you still find nuggets in there that, that, you know, open up your mind and heart and it, and it is a living word. And it's because the spirit is in us and constantly, as you say, revealing. Speaker 3 00:14:31 Yeah. And, and not, and the Spirit's not just revealing. He Christ he's revealing the father and he's revealing himself to us. Now, I know they're very closely linked, obviously because it's a Trinity, but that's, what's so awesome. I love the fact that we are studying this now, because I think I mentioned in the last episode that of the three persons of the Godhead, this holy spirit is the one that's the most mysterious, I think, to most Christians and the most misunderstood, and sometimes just downright blast themed in that they blame him for things that he's not doing. The holy spirit wasn't to give given, to make you feel guilty, to convict you when you're bad, that's a lie. That's not what he's there for. In fact, he's, he's there to convince you that you are the righteousness of God, the beloved forgiven of the Lord. Speaker 3 00:15:21 So as as I go into this next thing I wanted to first read, there are some, two quintessential areas. I mean, there's a lot in the new Testa them. And then even the old about the spirit, but John chapter 14 and 15 and 16, two, but really 14 is when Jesus, he's preparing to go to the cross and he's telling his disciples, okay. He says this. He says, when he goes, he says, and I will ask the father and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever. The spirit of truth, the world cannot accept him because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him for, he lives with you and will be in you. I will not leave you as orphans. I will come to you before long. The world will not see me anymore, but you will see me because I live. Speaker 3 00:16:18 You also will live. And on that day, you will realize that I am in the father and you are in me and I am in you. I want to touch on that before I read the, a couple more stances there, but I love how he says that he's going to come to us. He said, I will not leave you as orphans. I will come to you. So if you wanna know the name of the holy spirit, it's Christ Jesus that's Christ in you, the spirit is Christ in you. He, he says, yes, I'm gonna send another help for an, a, an advocate. But then he all also says that I'm coming to you. He's coming to you as spirit now, but it's Christ in you, Speaker 2 00:16:59 Mark. If I can quickly pitch in this. Sure. I think too, that's a very, very awesome point that you made that, you know, holy spirit is Christ in us, you know, in fact, right. You know, if you think about it, our largest Christ is in heaven, bodily, and, uh, we are on this earth, right? But the Bible says that we are seated in heavenly places in Christ Jesus. And the Bible also says that Christ well in us. So how is that possible? That link is in finite spirit, even though Christ is in heaven and we are on earth because of the holy spirit. He actually places us in Christ and he brings Christ to us. In fact, our whole, um, of the Christian life is about simply receiving of the new man that is in Christ, right? And living out our new man, or in other words, you know, letting Christ live in us, the resurrected Christ that is in heaven, the human Christ, right? It's not God Christ. The resurrected human Christ in heaven is living in us. So that is through the work of the holy spirit. So when we trusted in the Lord, Jesus Christ, when we rushed in him and as we behold him, right? Holy spirit is simply taking Christ and bringing him into us and manifesting his, his life in us. And that is the primary work of the holy spirit. Again, Speaker 3 00:18:28 That led S line said on that day, you will realize that I am in the father and you are in me and I am in you. So another point I could point out there, the name of the spirit is the father too, because it's the Trinity that's come to us. We've got Christ in the spirit Christ coming as spirit. And, and once you've got the, the son and the spirit, you've got the father and you too. So it's God in us. And so I, I love that. Uh, John 14, 25 says all this, I have spoken while still with you, but the advocate, the holy spirit, whom the father will send in my name will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you. You heard me say, I am going away and I am coming back to you. So on the day of Pentecost, and on the day we put our faith in Christ. Speaker 3 00:19:24 That was Christ coming back to us after dying and resurrecting directly coming back to us. So I love what he said there in that last line, he said that the advocate, the holy spirit will teach you all things and remind you of everything. I said to you, that is such a valuable gift throughout my life. When I think of the times that the spirit has prompt, did me, that has taught me, don't do this, do that. This is wise. This is unwise. The times he's brought up scripture to my mind. I don't know how I retain scripture apart from the spirit, because I'm a pretty forget forgetful person around the house. I can't remember what I just did with the spoon. I took out to stir my coffee, but I can quote scripture for the next five hours. Do you? So it's just so many people think they're unable to memorize. Speaker 3 00:20:22 Don't even memorize, just read and meditate on because a lot of the stuff I know I didn't sit down and try to memorize. No, I do occasionally, but the spirit brings the things up that we read and he teaches us. And I'm not. And this, this gift of having him as a teacher and a reminder what a blessing to cause. So many people think that the spirit teaches us things. As in teaching us a lesson like you did wrong, the Spirit's gonna bring something bad to teach you a lesson. Yes, it's for your own good, but I'm going to make you get in a car crash, or you're gonna get sick, or your daughter's gonna get cancer. That's not how he teaches us. He gave us a spirit to teach us during, through his word and through his spirit, not by punishing us to teach us a lesson. Speaker 3 00:21:13 That's not the kind of father we have. We have a perfect and good father. And so tied with that teacher and reminder are also another name that the apostle Paul used for the spirit I'll go quickly through, because I think they're related. And that he's the spirit of wisdom and understanding the reason he's remind us, he's reminding us of the things that Christ said in scripture and teaching us things is so that we will have wisdom and understanding. And in first Corinthians it says, he gives us his spirit so that we, he will understand everything he has freely given us. How awesome is that, that the Spirit's teaching. He wants us to know those things. Why do you think God wants us to know everything he's freely given us so that we're smarter so that we can be theologians and we can preach it a church. Speaker 3 00:22:06 Now he wants us to receive them. Why wouldn't the father who gave us all these gifts, want us to receive them all? He would, this is an old illustration I used to use, but I think it's, apropo imagine coming down on Christmas morning and in your family room, your rich uncle has sent you a Christmas present and it's P beautifully decorated with paper and ribbons and every kind of bow. And there's a Christmas card on top. Imagine coming down, taking that Christmas card, opening it and saying, oh, this is awesome. Thanks uncle putting the card down, pushing the president away. Would that be crazier? What? No, but he's given us a spirit. So can receive all the gifts he's given us what a great thing that is. So I'm gonna pass it on to Tim. Now, I believe Speaker 1 00:22:57 I just wanna make one comment on what you just said too. And that is that, um, revelation comes over time. Sometimes it's, you are not given the full revelation on everything all at once. You're given those revel either as they become applicable to your life, or you reach a maturity in understanding where you can accept and handle it. I mean, we, we grow and learn and you know, if someone wants to know, why doesn't God just give you all this knowledge and everything right up front? Well, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have been able to handle it, but he continues reveal himself and the spirit and the, and God, and all the things that I need to know, knowledge, wisdom, understanding slowly over time. And that's a blessing for someone who's slow like me. Well, Speaker 3 00:23:43 You know, the, also Paul said the same thing and he believed the same thing, because if you I'm in the midst of doing this, and I know I've mentioned it, but I think bear's worth repeats. Bear's repeating that if you look at how Paul prays for other believers, I almost in every single prayer, he prays for the, the spirit to come to us. He calls it different things. He calls it the spirit of wisdom and revelation. He prays that the spirit would enlighten the eyes of our heart, but it's always so that we might know God better. God has given us the spirit to know him better. He's our interface for lack of a better word, into a connection with God into understanding and revelation and receiving. Speaker 1 00:24:31 Amen. So I'm gonna take us to the next point in Las AJ, did you have something you wanted to say? Speaker 2 00:24:38 Yeah. So, uh, just one more scripture in relation to understanding and also teaching, you know, it is very comforting scripture, eh, in, um, one John chapter two and John writing to the believers, he says in one John chapter two in 26, these things have returned. I have returned to you concerning those who try to deceive you, but anointing, which you have received from him abides in you. And you do not need anyone teach you, but the same anointing teaches you concerning all things. And it's true and is not a lie. And just as it has taught you, you will abide in him. So again, here it is ING to the holy spirit and every believer has this anointing. So every believer has the ability you to understand the things of God and the holy spirit will teach from within. It doesn't mean that we don't go to church. Speaker 2 00:25:34 We don't hear others, but as we hear the word, as we read the scriptures, it's a holy spirit. That gives us understanding because as, uh, mark, you said, uh, there is, uh, this parable of soul and seed, right? The four soils, you know, the first three people, you know, they did not bear fruit because they did not understand the gospel. And in fact, the first type of soil where it fell by the wayside, the scripture says, you know, the devil took the seed away because they heard the gospel, but did not understand it, but because we have the holy spirit of God in us, when we receive the word of God, he also gives us understanding. And when we understand, that's when we bear fruit, uh, mark, you know, you're big on, uh, understanding, but, you know, the understanding also has a big role in bearing fruit. Once we hear gospel and understand the gospel, that's when we bear through 30 fold and 60 fold and a hundred fold. And that understanding comes because of the anointing that is within us. Speaker 3 00:26:39 Well, that just really kind of makes sense when you think about it, because as you understand and receive, you're being transformed into the image of Christ. Yeah. And that's the ultimate fruit bearing. There could be what could be a greater value to those around us than us becoming more like Jesus, one final thought before Tim takes us away. And I, I mentioned the beginning that people think that the spirit teaches us by punishing us. And they'll say, well, mark, look at the old Testament. Whenever Israel would go astray, he would send armies to conquer them or plagues or famines. And I'll say, yeah, you're absolutely right. That's the way you learn under the law by punitive, you know, punishment. That's what the law brings condemnation and punishment. And even in the old Testament, when God sent those things under the law, it was always to bring Israel back to him by faith though. So that that's just a perfect illustration of, we learn under the new covenant, by God's spirit, who is Christ, the old covenant. We learn by punishment, Speaker 1 00:27:51 Interesting point. And I, I like that. Um, I'm gonna take us in a slightly different direction. Uh, I, the spirit is called the spirit of life and it all the way back to the very beginning of Genesis, uh, it shows in Genesis two, that when God made Adam from the dust of the ground, he breathed into his nostrils, the breath of life, and man became a living soul. So the spirit is the foundation of human life. That now, again, I, I said this in the last podcast, that the Hebrew word, and I'm not a Hebrew scholar, I'm sure I'm mispronouncing. This is RO or Rouch. Um, and it means either breath or spirit. So that's, it's a very interesting juxtaposition there. And so he's the base for our life in of Eden, Adam and Eve were filled with the holy spirit. They communed with God. Speaker 1 00:28:51 They had a perfect relationship up until sin entered the world through the eating of the, the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Then we don't have that relationship anymore. So now the spirit, when we accept Christ comes back into us as humans and restores that relationship. So in Romans eight, it says, because through Jesus Christ, the law of the spirit who gives life has set you free, free from the law of sin and death. So it is his in dwelling that, that separates us from the law of sin and death and fills us with life. So, I mean, these are, this is, he was there in the old Testament. And now back in the new Testament, he restores that relationship that we lost and gives us eternal life. Speaker 3 00:29:45 Yeah. That's awesome. Speaker 2 00:29:47 Yeah. So Tim, uh, just to add onto that, right. You know, yes. You know, it's the spirit who gives us life, like you said, he gave us life, you know, when human beings we are created, right. And then even after we are saved, then you know, he gives back the life that we lost in the, um, God of Eden. But, you know, there is a one more scripture that says, you know, um, in the same chapter, uh, Roman chapter eight, verse 11. But if the spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead verse in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies, through the spirit who well in you. So, you know, when Lord Jesus Christ was crucified and, and he died and he was buried, right. Who raised Jesus from the dead? It's the holy spirit is the spirit of life that raised Jesus from the, and when we believe on the Lord, Jesus Christ, the same resurrection life that he raised Jesus with, he minister to us. Speaker 2 00:30:51 And that's what it says, right? The same resurrection with the same resurrection life, he quickens our spirits and he also gives life to our mortal bodies. So even as we are living on this side of the earth, even though these bodies are not going to live forever. And, um, and you know, we will get new bodies someday, but even while we are on this earth, right, because of the holy spirit that is living in us, you know, he can give life to our mortal bodies. That means, you know, we can stay healthy even on this side of, Speaker 3 00:31:23 That's a great point, AJ. And I love that point, especially, even though I feel like I'm still a teenager mentally, sometimes physically, when you get up in the morning or just getting outta bed, you don't feel like that. You know? So the fact that the spirit is giving a life, not just to our spirits, but our mortal bodies is such a strength and a blessing for me. There's one scripture. I don't have the number with me now, but it says, even though we are outwardly DEC outward, outwardly decaying, the spirit is renewing our lives internally. I love that one. I wish I had the address for me, but you can. Uh, Speaker 2 00:32:01 And second cor chapter four, Speaker 3 00:32:03 You got the reading there. Once you read it in KJV and new KJV Speaker 2 00:32:08 Second Corton, chapter four and verse 16. Therefore we do not lose heart, even though our outward man is Pering yet. The inward man is being renewed day by day. Speaker 3 00:32:19 And I think as we get older and older, some of these life verses are gonna have more and more meaning to us as we, uh, oh one, just a one quick little side note on life. And that is, there's a great scripture. Don't have it with me. But again, Paul's talking about, um, that when the believer physically dies on this earth, that he describes it as being swallowed up by life. I love that even though on this side, all the people that love us, it's gonna look to us like we died. That's the last way we would describe we're experiencing. We're just gonna be swallowed up by life. And that life comes from the spirit. Um, here's, here's some ma I've heard you talk and I'm gonna read the scripture. And if you'd comment on it, I I'd like you to, if you would. It said it says, but if Christ is in you, then even though your body is subject to death, because of the spirit is life because of righteousness. Speaker 2 00:33:23 Yeah. So mark, I think I am also reminded of Romans five 17, right? It says, uh, day that received the gift of righteousness will reign in life. So just as you know, um, death and sin tied together, right. You know, because we sin, we died similarly, you know, because now we receive the right just death and sin together, righteousness and life are together. So in order to receive life, if you're under sin and if you are still sin, there's no way we can, uh, uh, receive life because sin, the consequence of sin is death. So unless we are delivered from sin, we cannot receive life. So what Lord Jesus does is that is all the justification is about. So God could not give us life. If we were still sinners, that's why through the Christ finished work, right? You, he has to first justify us. Speaker 2 00:34:17 You know, when we believe on the Lord, Jesus Christ, it's, you know, Paul wrote the entire book of Romans. It is about justification by faith. We don't talk about it much, but what happens in justification is we are declare righteous and that qualifies us for receiving life. So it's a spirit that gives us life because we are declare righteous. And before justification through faith in know we are qualified to receive life. But when we receive the life of God, when we receive Christ himself, right, not only we are declared righteous, but our spirits actually become righteous. That's why the Bible says, you know, if any man is in Christ is a new creation. All things have passed away. And, uh, all things, uh, all things have become new and, uh, inefficient. It says, right? You know, you put out the whole man and put on the new man created in Christ Jesus in righteousness and true holiness. We don't become any more. Holy, we don't become any more righteous. We are already righteous in Christ. We simply put on the new man by faith. And I think to your point, uh, mark, the spirit is life because of righteousness because we, if we were not righteous, we couldn't have had the spirit. Now we could have the life that the spirit gives us. Speaker 3 00:35:36 Yeah. I love the way you put it about sin and death being tied together and righteousness and life being tied together. It makes so much sense. Yeah. Sin leads to death. Righteousness leads to life. Of course, that's the righteousness of God. The perfect righteousness that we're given when we put our faith in Jesus. Speaker 2 00:35:58 In fact, that is mentioned throughout the scriptures, right? The whole purpose of the law is Israels. You know, they didn't want to keep the law just for the sake of keeping the law and getting the PA pat on their back. The purpose of keeping the law is if they perfectly keep the law and prove themselves to be right, righteous, the reward is life. So in order to get that life, they kept the law. But you know, of course we know no one could, uh, keep the law, but it is there throughout the scriptures. You read Deuteronomy, you read anywhere. This shall be a righteousness. If you keep the whole law and in Roman chapter 10, Paul also summarizes that. Speaker 3 00:36:40 Yeah, there's a scripture in that area where God says to Israel, choose this day, life or death that that's paraphrase, but that's your choice. You die. If you don't keep the law perfectly, if you keep it perfectly, then you have life. But of course nobody ever could. And the law was never given for that purpose. It was to get show you absolutely that you can't do it. And you need a savior. And God obviously provided the savior for us. Speaker 2 00:37:12 Yeah. In Roman chapter 10 words, five, Paul summarizes that for Moses rights about the righteousness of the law, the man who does those things shall live by them. But the righteousness of faith speaks this way. Do not say in your heart, who will ascend to heaven. That is to bring Christ from a bow and who will dissent to the, that is to bring Christ from the dead. But what does it say? The word is near you in your mouth and in, but again, like I think the, I was actually focusing on verse fights is Moses writes about the righteousness of the law. A man who does those things shall live by them. So the purpose of keeping the law is to attain this eternal life, right? You know, that's the desire of everybody. They want to get this eternal life because every, you know, we are under death and sooner or later everyone has to die. Speaker 3 00:38:04 So then the spirit gives life and it's through the spirit that we're saved. He draws us to Christ so that, uh, his sacrifices applied to us, our sins are taken. His righteousness is given to us. He gives us the spirit as a seal of a ownership and deposit. But here's the, here's the tripping point that we've talked about this many times from gala Galatians. One people start by the spirit and try to move to the flesh. In other words, they agree. It's all faith, all Christ to come to him. But now I better get to work. Now I need to sanctify myself, which means to make holy, I need to do all the right things. Now that I'm a Christian. I have no excuse for not following the law perfectly. So the holy spirits, not only, um, what's the word. So innately part of our salvation scripture tells us he's also the one that makes us holy and sanctifies us in this world over time. Speaker 3 00:39:08 First, Peter one two says, uh, that we have been chosen according to the, for knowledge of God, the father, through the sanctifying work of the spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood. So the work of sanctification belongs to the holy spirit. Romans 1516 says that we are sanctified by the holy spirit. Romans eight 13 says that it's by the spirit we put to death, the miss deeds of the body. So our sanctification, our holiness in Ephesians two, it says for, we are God's handy work created in Christ Jesus to do good works. It's somewhere, somewhere else says that, uh, it's God who works. His eternal purposes in our lives, says it all over the place. We are not our own self-improvement projects. That's the world who there's a million self-help books and, and, uh, conferences and motivational speakers. We don't work on ourselves. The spirit works in us, transforming us into Christ as we re him, contemplate him and see him clearly. But the only way to see him clearly is also to remove that veil of the law. Yeah. Cause that the law kills the law kills, but the spirit brings life. Speaker 2 00:40:30 Yeah. I just want to try to say one thing here. Uh, so sanctification simply involves, you know, living by our new man, right? So Bible says in our spirits are already made perfect. And we are in Christ, but we are still in our old bodies. So we have this tendency to live the old way of life because we have our old bodies and we are, have our own old memories. And it's easy to fall back to living by the life. That's what is called living by the flesh. But what sanctification is, is basically for us to be able to live by our new man, more and more, right. That is only by faith. Again, you know, sometimes if we don't fully understand this, you know, some people might go back to again, um, going in this mode, right? I have the holy spirit of God and the holy spirit tells me something. Speaker 2 00:41:26 I have to do something in the power of my flesh. So what they're doing is they're trying to make the old, Maney the spirit that's not going to happen. So our new life simply involves living by the new man that we are already created in Christ Jesus. But as we rested more and more in our righteousness, as we see more and more of our Lord, Jesus Christ, the holy spirit manifests more and more of our new creation that we are already made in Christ Jesus. So he's not making our spirit anymore righteous than it is already made. And he's not going to give us, make our divine nature more divine because Bible says, right now we have received our divine nature. So, but as long as we are in this world, we have a choice. You know, we can go back and live our old way by the flesh, or we can live our new way through the spirit. And the new way is always by faith. Speaker 3 00:42:23 Yeah. And just to kind of further, uh, clarify on that when AJ says we have our choice to go back and live by the flesh, that does mean, yeah, we sin, but it also means by the law to go back to the old way of trying to gain your righteousness by the law, that's the opposite that you know, that the new man does lives by the spirit, not by the law. So going back and trying to do by your flesh can mean going back and just sin whenever you want, or it can. And going back and trying to do, do, do look how good I am. I can keep all this stuff. So, and, uh, one thing I think that you really pointed out well, uh, Jay is just the difference in that Christ has made us in spirit, perfectly righteous already, but in this world is Tim likes to point out a lot. Speaker 3 00:43:15 We're not perfect yet. We're still being transformed and transformed means going from one thing to another. And since it's not past tense that we are being transformed by the spirit as we go from glory to glory ever increasing glory. That point that yes, in one set, we are perfect, perfectly righteous. And another sense we're still in our old bodies, as you pointed out and Hebrews 10, 14, I love this one cuz I just think it points it out so perfectly. It says for one by one sacrifice, referring to Christ, he has made perfect forever. Those who are being made holy. So in God's sight, we are perfect forever. He's already made us perfect forever. It's a done deal just as you plant a seed and you water it and it grows into what it's gonna become. The seed has been planted. It's guaranteed that we are perfect forever. He's in the middle of growing a us into that perfection, even in the old man. Would you, uh, agree with that? Not that the old man's ever gonna become perfect, but you know what I mean? Yeah. Speaker 2 00:44:23 So I think the other way to look at it is I think you're saying the same thing. Uh, as I'm saying mark, the other way to look at it is, uh, I'll quickly wrap it up. I think we are at time. Uh, but you know, we are spirit, soul and body, right? We are a three parts, uh, creature, so to speak. So when we are born again, we receive new spirits and we also receive a new heart and that is a new nature. And uh, then, but the body is still old. So as long as we are here, right, you know, we can live by the body, right. That is living outside in, or we can live by the spirit inside out. So living inside out is basically living the new life and living outside in, in spirit of having the spirit that is still living the whole life. So I think as we growing in grace and as we are transformed more and more into the image of Christ, right, we will live more and more inside out. So outside in living will go become less and less. And inside out living will be becoming more and more. And that's where the soul becomes. Uh, a really, uh, because soul is a connection, the spirit and the body. So the soul could listen to the body and live like old man or the soul could listen to the spirit and live like the new man. Speaker 1 00:45:45 Uh, I think we bit off, more than we could chew tonight. I thought when we started this, we had a whole list of things we were gonna talk about. I didn't think we, uh, put my much of Aden in that. So I'm, I'm thinking there's gonna be another part to this next time we get together. But in the spirit of, uh, fair play, does anybody have any last, last comments? They wanna leave everybody with mark? Speaker 3 00:46:07 Uh, I think I'll, I'll, I'll play these as the poker terminology is I'll just stand pat on this hand and pathology. Speaker 2 00:46:16 Yeah. I think we have talked a lot already. So I think we'll just say, you know, we are, uh, thankful to God and we are so thankful for the revelations that he gives us and the desire to learn more and know more of the spirit and the father and our Lord Jesus Christed. Speaker 3 00:46:33 And we do that through this spirit. He's given us. Yeah. Speaker 2 00:46:36 Thanks Speaker 1 00:46:37 Guys. And anybody listening, if you have a comment, feel free to let us know email Facebook. If you feel like giving us a thumbs up a star, a subscription, uh, anything that, uh, like that helps us out and you can do it on whatever media you use to driver us into your podcasts. That'll be it for today. Thanks guys. We'll talk again. The next time We would like to thank you for listening to the unveiling. We hope you have enjoyed it enough to consider subscribing and sharing with others. We welcome your questions, comments, and feedback. You can reach us via email@theunveiledgospelatyahoo.com or find our Facebook page at the unveiling podcast for IJ, mark and myself. God bless. And we will talk with you next time.